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	<title>Comments on: Ask for forgiveness, not for permission</title>
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	<link>http://www.markhneedham.com/blog/2010/06/04/ask-for-forgiveness-not-for-permission/</link>
	<description>Thoughts on Software Development</description>
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		<title>By: Marcos Eliziário Santos</title>
		<link>http://www.markhneedham.com/blog/2010/06/04/ask-for-forgiveness-not-for-permission/comment-page-1/#comment-39064</link>
		<dc:creator>Marcos Eliziário Santos</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jun 2010 17:42:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.markhneedham.com/blog/?p=2461#comment-39064</guid>
		<description>While I totally agree with you, one must not forget the messy politics around some organizations.
If your organization is not based on solid values like valuing results more than ass-licking, professionalism over cliques and office politics, you can be in big trouble if you go through this route. And paradoxically, you&#039;ll end up more likely being punished if your attempt at change is succesful than not.

That is, depending on the organization, even if you discover the cure of cancer as a result of your explorations, you run the risk of not being &quot;forgiven&quot;. Because you violated the processes, the traditions, the ivory towers of power, and for some organization, this kind of thing is unforgivable.

Unfortunatelly, in some organizations, people on power want to make sure developers are mere button pushers, and thus, for this kind of people, any initiative not sanctioned by them is seen as a threath for their power. And this kind of pathological reasoning occurs not only with some sad individuals, but with pathological teams also that really don&#039;t want anything that could shake them out of their confort zone.

So, the idea is excellent, but it pays to do a quick assesment of organizational health before trying it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While I totally agree with you, one must not forget the messy politics around some organizations.<br />
If your organization is not based on solid values like valuing results more than ass-licking, professionalism over cliques and office politics, you can be in big trouble if you go through this route. And paradoxically, you&#8217;ll end up more likely being punished if your attempt at change is succesful than not.</p>
<p>That is, depending on the organization, even if you discover the cure of cancer as a result of your explorations, you run the risk of not being &#8220;forgiven&#8221;. Because you violated the processes, the traditions, the ivory towers of power, and for some organization, this kind of thing is unforgivable.</p>
<p>Unfortunatelly, in some organizations, people on power want to make sure developers are mere button pushers, and thus, for this kind of people, any initiative not sanctioned by them is seen as a threath for their power. And this kind of pathological reasoning occurs not only with some sad individuals, but with pathological teams also that really don&#8217;t want anything that could shake them out of their confort zone.</p>
<p>So, the idea is excellent, but it pays to do a quick assesment of organizational health before trying it.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Needham</title>
		<link>http://www.markhneedham.com/blog/2010/06/04/ask-for-forgiveness-not-for-permission/comment-page-1/#comment-38622</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Needham</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jun 2010 23:11:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.markhneedham.com/blog/?p=2461#comment-38622</guid>
		<description>&quot;I&#039;m now led to believe that you&#039;d rather do what you want and waste your CLIENT&#039;s money to scratch an itch. Amazingly unprofessional. Let&#039;s all go to the movies and charge the client too!&quot;

I guess that&#039;s one way to interpret what I wrote but is it a waste of money if we discover a better way of doing something which means it takes less time than it might have taken previously?

To me it makes sense to spend a bit of time working out if that&#039;s the case rather than just doing it the same old way.

What I&#039;m suggesting isn&#039;t all that far from some of the ideas of lean software development  with respect to putting learning as one of the key goals on a software project.

It&#039;s also linked to delaying decisions until the last responsible moment until we have all the information needed to make a decision.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I&#8217;m now led to believe that you&#8217;d rather do what you want and waste your CLIENT&#8217;s money to scratch an itch. Amazingly unprofessional. Let&#8217;s all go to the movies and charge the client too!&#8221;</p>
<p>I guess that&#8217;s one way to interpret what I wrote but is it a waste of money if we discover a better way of doing something which means it takes less time than it might have taken previously?</p>
<p>To me it makes sense to spend a bit of time working out if that&#8217;s the case rather than just doing it the same old way.</p>
<p>What I&#8217;m suggesting isn&#8217;t all that far from some of the ideas of lean software development  with respect to putting learning as one of the key goals on a software project.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s also linked to delaying decisions until the last responsible moment until we have all the information needed to make a decision.</p>
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		<title>By: Andy</title>
		<link>http://www.markhneedham.com/blog/2010/06/04/ask-for-forgiveness-not-for-permission/comment-page-1/#comment-38616</link>
		<dc:creator>Andy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 06 Jun 2010 21:33:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.markhneedham.com/blog/?p=2461#comment-38616</guid>
		<description>Having never engaged Thoughtworks on a project before, I can tell you now that I will never do so, thanks to this article. Well done!

I&#039;m now led to believe that you&#039;d rather do what you want and waste your CLIENT&#039;s money to scratch an itch. Amazingly unprofessional. Let&#039;s all go to the movies and charge the client too!

You run things by people because they are paying you to do a job for them. If a plumber came to your house to fix a pipe and decided to use a technique he&#039;d just thought of (gummy bear seals?) you would be pretty enraged I&#039;m sure. It&#039;s all okay though! He can just ask for forgiveness later.

Thinking that you&#039;re cleverer than your management does not make it so, and working at Thoughtworks does not make you above your responsibility for transparent engagement with your paying clients.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Having never engaged Thoughtworks on a project before, I can tell you now that I will never do so, thanks to this article. Well done!</p>
<p>I&#8217;m now led to believe that you&#8217;d rather do what you want and waste your CLIENT&#8217;s money to scratch an itch. Amazingly unprofessional. Let&#8217;s all go to the movies and charge the client too!</p>
<p>You run things by people because they are paying you to do a job for them. If a plumber came to your house to fix a pipe and decided to use a technique he&#8217;d just thought of (gummy bear seals?) you would be pretty enraged I&#8217;m sure. It&#8217;s all okay though! He can just ask for forgiveness later.</p>
<p>Thinking that you&#8217;re cleverer than your management does not make it so, and working at Thoughtworks does not make you above your responsibility for transparent engagement with your paying clients.</p>
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		<title>By: Tweets that mention Ask for forgiveness, not for permission at Mark Needham -- Topsy.com</title>
		<link>http://www.markhneedham.com/blog/2010/06/04/ask-for-forgiveness-not-for-permission/comment-page-1/#comment-38515</link>
		<dc:creator>Tweets that mention Ask for forgiveness, not for permission at Mark Needham -- Topsy.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 05 Jun 2010 02:34:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.markhneedham.com/blog/?p=2461#comment-38515</guid>
		<description>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Rafael Rosa, Rafael Rosa. Rafael Rosa said: @andrewdeandrade I remembered you :) @markhneedham Ask for forgiveness, not for permission http://bit.ly/aHJUal [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Rafael Rosa, Rafael Rosa. Rafael Rosa said: @andrewdeandrade I remembered you <img src='http://www.markhneedham.com/blog/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  @markhneedham Ask for forgiveness, not for permission <a href="http://bit.ly/aHJUal" rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/aHJUal</a> [...]</p>
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